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Topic: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies

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My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (1/20)
 3/9/13 3:04am
Alohajohn
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If I continue cranking it might fire but won't run. I have been told that the problem could be the key cylinder is worn and the key is making a poor contact so I have bought a new lock cylinder and new key with the same ohms reading as the original to replace.
 
Anybody got any other thoughts..?
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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (2/20)
 3/9/13 8:27am
CaledoniaBrian
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If it is not cranking then you may have a problem with the VATs that could be related to the key and cylinder.  It would act like a dead battery.......... But this is not your case. Replacing the ignition is not going to do anything for you.
 
 Cranks but no start;  either you are not getting fuel or your not lighting the pugs. Time for some diagnostics. I would first look at the fuel pressure. Most likely a fuel pump.


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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (3/20)
 3/9/13 10:18am
396c4
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There's a very good article in the "Technically Speaking" section of Apr. issue of Vette that you should read. They go through all the reasons fuel & electronic, most of which you can check yourself. Actually scary how many things need to go right compared to a carb and distributor! Good luck, and for what it's worth, my money is on fuel pump ...

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (4/20)
 3/9/13 9:30pm
Alohajohn
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Thanks for the advice, I'm just reading that article now. I replaced my fuel pump with a new Bosch pump approx 5 years ago, at the same time replaced the fuel pressure regulator and the oil pressure switch behind the distributor. The car doesn't get much use maybe that's part of the problem.?
Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (5/20)
 3/9/13 9:35pm
Alohajohn
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Thanks for your advice. As you can see someone else also offered the same diagnoses...I appreciate your comments.
Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (6/20)
 3/10/13 12:20pm
Adams' Apple
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I would start with putting a pressure gauge on it to see what the fuel pressure is. The pump has to be running, or it wouldn't start to begin with. That being said, it doesn't mean the pump is putting out the correct pressure, or it might stop running after a few seconds. A gauge would narrow down the list of possibilities. If it starts and runs for that 5 seconds, it could be the oil pressure sensor. The fuel pump runs off of a relay to start, but it requires oil pressure to keep another relay energized after the initial start. See what the fuel pressure is doing first, then go from there. Thumbs Up

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (7/20)
 3/10/13 4:35pm
jonneyone
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not to be a smart assssssssss. you just could be out of gas.  ive ran into that before. the gage was way off.

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (8/20)
 3/11/13 2:22am
Alohajohn
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I'm tyring to get a hold of a fuel pressure guage. I have been told that their are two oil pressure switches/sending units, I know about the one behind the distributor [which has been replaced earlier] where is the other one.??
 
Oh, and the gas tank is near full..
Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (9/20)
 3/11/13 1:05pm
Adams' Apple
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You have one sender unit by the distributor, and the other is just above the oil filter. I had a pic here somewhere, but now I cannot find it. Cry

As a test, you can by-pass the one next to the distributor by using a jumper between the terminals. This will keep the fuel pump running IF the oil pressure sender is the problem. The sender by the oil filter is normally only used for the oil pressure gauge itself, and should have no effect on the fuel pump running.
The sender you want to by-pass will have an Orange wire, and a Red wire. Jumper these two terminals together, and it will eliminate the sender unit as the problem.
There are other things that could cause the same symptoms, but this is fairly easy to do quickly.


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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (10/20)
 3/12/13 12:45pm
jonneyone
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just a thought. let us know what you come up with.Thumbs Up

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (11/20)
 3/12/13 10:16pm
Alohajohn
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We installed the pressure guage onto the fuel line and the pressure read 50-52 psi...we tried the starter and the car started and ran perfectly for 10 minutes or so until we shut it down. During that time the fuel pressure dropped back to mid to high 40's psi so I'm guessing my fuel pump is Ok
 
Tried starting again and it just cranked over...nothing more. Checking error codes at that point it showed a #46
 
My tech still thinks it a worn key cylinder/bad key pellet contact problem so we're going to replace the cylinder next.
Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (12/20)
 3/13/13 7:38am
Adams' Apple
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If there was a problem with the key, or cylinder/contacts, the engine would not crank at all, much less start and run. Also, the "Security" lamp in the dash would come on steady. This is not going to be your problem.
Since you have confirmed good fuel pressure, the next most likely suspect is the ignition module. A failing module will certainly act the way yours is....starts and runs fine for a while, then won't start again until it completely cools down.

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (13/20)
 3/13/13 8:04am
CaledoniaBrian
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I am with Adam's Apple on this one........ Ign. module .

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (14/20)
 3/13/13 9:04am
Adams' Apple
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Code 46 means that the VATs signal is not getting to the ECM(Engine Control Module). This would disable the infectors, and create a no-start. So....it appears that your tech might be on the right track after all. Strange that it will crank tho...
What this means is that the key and cylinder are prolly ok, but there is probably a wiring/connector issue between the VATs module and the ECM. Usually, if the VATs module does not see the correct value from the key pellet, it will not allow the engine to crank. 

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (15/20)
 3/13/13 9:46am
tbirdsps
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Consider this:
 
The engine cranks indicating the VATS is OK.  If the ignition lock assembly was warn out then maybe it's not able to maintain the electronic connection thus the engine doesn't start or stay running.  But, the ignition switch is separate from the ignition key/lock assy.  They too can wear and not maintain the electrical connection.
 
If I was to throw parts at it I'd change the ignition switch first.  A $15 part similar to the Ford ignition switch. 
 
The key/lock VATS assy is around $35. 
 
I wouldn't think that the ignition control module is bad due to the symptoms but it could be.  The moving parts (key/lock assy and ignition Switch) would wear out first.
 
Just my 2 cents.


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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (16/20)
 3/15/13 5:33pm
jonneyone
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i had an 2002 vw that did the same thing had it towed back and forth to several dealerships. still under warnity it was the chip in the key that caused the problem. this was a night mare. new key fixed. sold it . however i agree with adams apple. this man knows his stuff. anyways let us know what caused it.

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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (17/20)
 3/15/13 7:35pm
Alohajohn
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Thanks guys for your continued interest...my tech guy has gone fishing for a week so I have to wait until end of next week before the saga continues. I will advise any or all outcomes.
Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (18/20)
 3/19/13 6:33am
Alohajohn
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Guys...thanks again for your interest and advice/comments.
 
We fitted the new key cylinder & wire today and she fired straight up, although it seemed to run a bit rich for a short while so I took her out for a short run to clear the cobwebs of 5 weeks of no activuty other than false starts.
 
I don't know for sure that the problem is fixed and I'm always going to be suspicious she might let me down but I guess time will tell....if I keep her that long.!!
 
 
John.
Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (19/20)
 3/19/13 9:10am
tbirdsps
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Woohoo!  Now you get to enjoy that ride.
 
If you had the battery disconnected during the 5 weeks the ECM probably just had to relearn it's parameters.  When you power down the ECM will not hold the settings, thus why it was rich for a time.


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Re: My '88 cranks, runs for 5 seconds then dies (20/20)
 3/19/13 12:34pm
Adams' Apple
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Clap Thumbs Up
Fingers crossed that that fixes it for good!


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